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Released a few days ago, Edmund, an entry in the Adult/Educational Compo at TIGSource. While at first glance, Edmund appears to be a game created just for ‘shock value’, but with a little digging I’ve found it does go a lot deeper then expected.

Paul Greasley, the creator of Edmund, recently let us pick his brain on the ‘demon’ he has unleashed.

Gamer Limit: For those who haven’t heard of you, can you give us a brief history or your game development career?

Paul Greasley: I’ve made lots of rubbish indie and commercial games, this would be my first attempt at a somewhat serious subject matter, and hopefully a halfway decent game.

To jump straight into it, what made you decide to make a game involving rape?

Inspiration was mostly personal, I’ve known a few girls who have been through similar situations, which sparked the concept. As far as the experience, I wanted to inspire emotion in the player, even if its vile and disgusting.

The discussion on various forums around your game has brought up an interesting debate; Why do you think people don’t mind stabbing, torturing or shooting people in video games, but take a moral high ground when it comes to rape?

Double standards… Maybe because people are desensitized to violence in games, sexual violence not so much. That being said, I think the reaction for the most part is perfectly natural.

What would you call Edmund; Expression, Art or a Game?

I would call it a experience, but others might not, I think that question is best left to the individual player.

With Edmund’s subject matter, was it a hard choice to release the game under your own name, and not a pseudonym?

I’ve made this game as genuine as I can possibly make it. In Australia, the country where I live, it has shown it can and will censor indie games with dangerous content. It has happened before and no doubt it will happen again. But end of the day I’ve got nothing to hide, I’m not promoting rape here, to anyone, ever. Hopefully people will play the game before judging it, and judging me as a person, that’s all I ask.

I know making this game will effect my livelihood, maybe my job prospects, I know some of my family and friends will think I’ve lost my mind (Hi Mum!), but that’s just how it goes.

How long did it take to get Edmund from concept to finished project?

The game took 4 weeks of work outside of a 9-5 grind, developed for the adult/educational competition at www.tigsource.com.

How much hate mail have you received so far regarding Edmund, any death threats?

You would be surprised…

The TigSource community appears really supportive towards your game, while the IndieGamer community is quite… venomous… why do you think this is?

Because TIGSource is awesome, thumbs up to Derek Yu and Melly for creating the competition, and all the other editors over there that work really hard to build a strong indie community where competitions like this are possible, and most importantly, all the people at TIGSource who keep building indie games, and those playing them.

And now to answer your question, I think Indiegamer forum is mostly focused on the business side of Independent Game development, while TIGSource is a hub for game design and experimentation, so they are a little more accepting of these sorts of games.

Currently there are four known endings for Edmund, are there still any secrets left to find?

Look harder…

And now that you have got a controversial game under your belt, what do you have planned next?

Two months ago I was going to quit game development, I think it’s a bit early to figure that one out, maybe take a break and build a muscle car?

Thanks for taking the time to talk to us.

No problem, a massive thank you to Compound, who not only did a amazing job on the audio, but was there to assist with the game design and making the project possible in 4 weeks.

———–

You can snag a copy of Edmund here, but be warned… it’s not for the faint of heart.

  1. I’m really glad you got this interview. After you showed me Edmund last week I was pretty horrified, not by the game but by myself for what I “appeared” to be doing. Nice stuff.

  2. Great interview. As for the game itself, it’s compelling stuff. The criticisms are definitely unjustified.

  3. avatar ChrisW

    What!?! Double standards?!? I’d like to remind everyone that stumbles upon this article that even in war, rape is illegal. It doesn’t even matter if the victim is an enemy combatant.

    THAT’S WHERE THE MORAL LINE IS!!! There’s no double standards about it!

    So, don’t feed anyone any b.s. that gamers are desensitized by the plethora of immoral things already in video games. Rape, in contrast to the most hellish conditions a person can be put in [i.e. war], is immoral.

  4. avatar ChrisW

    Mind you, the above comment is refering to the controlling of the simulated act of rape only.

  5. avatar Peter

    so… are we supposed to be gettign desensitised to rape too then?
    does that make it more ok?

    • avatar George

      I feel So sorry for Stephanie J Block she is brillant as Elphaba but she is out shneid by Idina Menzel because Idina was in two production of Wicked (orginal and broadway) and stephanie was in the on after Idina in the U.S. I was kind of hoping she was going to be in the Australian verison but Jemma Rix was awesome so its all good

  6. It’s not about desensitizing, it should be about using our medium in a responsible way to look at mature issues, of which rape is one.

    Plus if you do get the chance to play, ask yourself why is the rapist committing the act while you play through.

    In my opinion Edmund is not all about the moment of the rape itself, it is what has happened to this person that they commit such an act and why.

  7. It’s easy to dismiss something as bad and wrong without a second thought when you look at just the actions and not the causes and the implications.

  8. The game, albeit a short one, tells a story. Rape is a part of that story. It doesn’t glorify it, nor use it gratuitously, it merely uses it.
    For all the people horrified and offended by it, please, do not go to a library, and if you do, make sure you stick in the section which has talking animals as main characters.

  9. avatar justin?

    hi mum! LOL he sounds like a cool guy. downloading the game now.

    • avatar Serhat

      A a sixteen year old mulsim girl, i am so sickened by this article. i literally wanted to cry. i cannot believe some of the things written in here but i know it is true. these molesters are the people that are making it hard for the rest of the mulsims in this world live peacefully. they are so wrong in their ways. do u know that the punishment for rape is eternal burning in the pits of hell. islam does not promote this type of behvior and these people are wrong. Please do not judge our religion by what these infedels do.

    • avatar Anton

      Hey lia. Tried your game was kinda fun xD only request I have is to have an isnatnt retry button or the like if u just know you’ve messed up and wanna quickly restart that level. Or immediately start the level without showing the Play/Map Select’ window after clicking retry’ on the Chompy didn’t make it’ window. I needed that badly for last level of map pack1 lol

  10. avatar justin?

    already playing edmond.is awesome, you created a master piece mr.Paul Greasley.is not a game about rape is an exelent expirience about life and human nature.what is wrong and what is right.

    i hope this game is a model to follow and i hope more games in the future are like this. about time developers grew some balls and make games that are not just for entretainment but and experience that stays whit you.

    dont get me wrong i am not saying rape is good.cause is not : (. i come from a decent family that goes to church every sunday so belive me this game is totally not porn! mr.Paul Greasley you shouldnt quit game development you should continue making great expiriences.

    your family will understand this is what you love your carrer and dont pay attention to the people talking bad about it they dont know your are making art! :)

    i hope in the future see one of your games on a big console like a ps3 until then keep up the good work. thatll be awesome :O

    from:your biggest fan from now on

  11. avatar pOOKIEeASTWOOD

    Retarded.

    • avatar Gizem

      PAINKILLER RECIPEPusser’s Painkiller was created in the British Virgin Islands. It is seervd in almost every restaurant and on every island in the British Virgin Islands. It is now considered the official drink of the BVI’s.2 4 oz Pusser’sae dark rum4 oz pineapple juice1 oz cream of coconut1 oz orange juiceComes in numbers 2, 3, and 4 based on amount of rum. Serve on the rocks. Stir and grate fresh nutmeg on the top.

  12. avatar Aus

    I can understand on what this guy is trying to convey as i am utterly repulsed by watching that video above. Im sure thats the reaction he would expect people to have.
    I cant say i support any game with rape in it and i really hope there are no idea’s for rape to be included in any mainstream games in the future where the player commits the act.

    • avatar Sylilesten

      labs, etc., etc. Of course this all comes back to us the vonitg public doesn’t it? If we cared enough, as a society, about providing a dignified form of meaningful justice for rape victims then they would have it, because we have the power to vote out anyone at any governmental level who demonstrates the least bit of indifference toward fully and enthusiastically prosecuting this crime. The sad reality is we obviously don’t care enough. Tragically, we don’t care enough about justly punishing rape even as much as the NRA cares about protecting our right to bear assault weapons.

  13. avatar ChrisW

    One point that people seem to be missing here is that the WHOLE “rape in games” issue came from the banning of a Japanese hentai (anime-porn) rape simulator on Amazon.com. Many of those games are explicit and reward the player through acts of rape, though not always considered violent.

    This game here [Edmund] is a feeble attempt to dapple in this hot controversy. Paul Greasly knows this and is trying to gain popularity from it. Throwing around words like “double standard” is simply a lame attempt to justify his medium. Tossing in some sort of quasi-personal background to validate his inspiration is an even lamer attempt to justify it (even if true).

    Going back to the controversy of the banning of a rape game; the main reason why it is a controversy is that it can be perceived as a blatant remission of what people in democratic countries consider a freedom of expression or speech. Yet even those countries have a limit to what is considered socially acceptable. For instance, look up the “Obscenity clause” on Wikipedia under the First Amendment of the United States Bill of Rights.

    If you seriously condone, approve, or encourage the concept of simulating rape in games, even under artistic grounds, then what do you think about child pornography in games? Hm? Why not? Or what about a rape simulation games where the victims are children? Hm? Disgusting?!?

    Where, OH WHERE, shall we draw the moral line?

  14. I’d seriously consider you to read the same article you are pointing us to, as the obscenity is in regards to an “offensive way and has no serious literary, artistic, political or scientific value”.
    However, it does say distinction beyond this was made in regards to Child Pornography, as a result of protecting children. Yet, in media, as no children will be involved, surely it reverts back to whether it contains literary, artistic, political or scientific value?

    To deny the ability to explore these theme, denies the progress as video games as an art form. Many themes that are vile, disgusting, and produce mostly feelings of loathing exist in books, and many other art forms. For what reason are video games now somehow beyond reasoning when it comes to exploring such adult themes? Is a mature game limited to “Headshots” and “Gibs” Purely out of some moral reserve?

    This game may not be the most ground breaking example of an adult theme in a game, but it serves as an example of what games can achieve, and as it has been mentioned, in this game rape is merely a possibility. For the player to see such an action, they must be willing to interact with the game in such a way.

  15. avatar ChrisW

    Paul Clark,

    Firstly, to clarify my point. I stated in my 3rd post, 3rd paragraph, “Going back to the controversy of the banning of a rape game…” Meaning, not referring to Edmund or this article. However, I did mention, Paul Greasly is simply looking for notoriety or infamy concerning this. Nonetheless, I care not for his prerogatives.

    Now to your point of view.

    Your analogy of trying to shy people away from other medias, i.e. books, because they may have instances of vile or disgusting situations (such as rape) in them holds little validity. In those instances, the reader is not directly in control in the act of rape. They are, however, in control of deciding to whether or not continue reading. Refer back to my 2nd posting where I mentioned, “…the above comment [my 1st posting] is referring to the controlling of the simulated act of rape.” I believe that there is a distinctive line between viewing/reading about fictional or non-fictional instances of rape and being directly involved in controlling the instance of simulated rape. The latter is abhorrently more obscene.

    Concerning child pornography, I find it funny that you commented about distinction being a result of protecting children. Hmmm… Obviously, in your opinion, women don’t need protection. Oh well.

    BUT! You did say that “…in media, as no children will be involved…” Did you know that in Japan it wasn’t until 1999 the production of child pornography was banned? In addition, did you know that in Japan it wasn’t until 2008 that possession of child pornography was illegal?

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/mar/10/japan

    So you see, in media, it was used. Especially in rape simulation PC games and in Manga (Japanese comic books). How do you feel about this? It actually exists. Is that a moral line crossed way too far for you?

    Lastly, this issue is not so much about “headshots” and “gibs.” That moral line has already been crossed and to some extent accepted. This issue is about crossing the next moral line in mainstream media.

    So tell me, why is it a double standard to accept something vile, disgusting, or loathsome that has already been accepted in comparison to accepting something that is vile, disgusting, or loathsome that has not yet been accepted?

    Easy answer, it is human nature’s to attempt to be humane.

    • avatar Madrast

      Where do you even begin to think you have the authority to make this kind of a post, let alone this kind of jgmduent? I have a bit of a background doing comedy Fine. You can be the authority on when it’s okay to make jokes about comedians.This is like making a jgmduent on when it’s okay to make a Holocaust joke when you’re not a survivor. Or when it is okay to make a pedophilia joke when you haven’t been molested.I follow this blog because I think you usually have something worthwhile to say. But right now you really just need to get a clue.

  16. avatar ChrisW

    [edit]
    Actually, it isn’t a double standard to accept something vile, disgusting, or loathsome that has already been accepted in comparison to accepting something that is vile, disgusting, or loathsome that has not yet been accepted. It is simply human nature’s to attempt to be humane.

  17. My comment in regards to the protection of children, while ignoring the protection of women, was due to the article you pointed towards, which only mentioned such a consideration.

    The game presents you with an option to rape, as does every day life. There is no pressure to further the game by doing that, a) you can complete the game without it, and b) you can walk away. Never is an action forced upon the user.

    My comment was poorly phrased with the word “media” what I meant was, in this game for example it has the possibility to depict a woman being raped, yet no-one was actually raped. Only sprites were harmed.
    In Alan Moore’s Lost Girls, there is depiction of what could be classed as child pornography, yet, it is merely a graphic novel, no children were involved. That was what I meant, but I understand it was very poorly phrased.

    I don’t particularly class a distinction between interacting in game’s violence, and reading a crime thriller depicting a brutal murder, or if you are going to mention visual stimulus, a horror movie like Saw. Whilst I may press a button, I am never commiting this act, it is all just pixels. I believe making such a distinction is an argument that has never been proven to have a real affect, and is only holding video games back as being “oh, those kids with they pokey mons.”

    I do not think this game is a step too far, I think the reaction to the game is sensationalism gone too far. Just like happened earlier in the year in the UK regarding offensive comedy (Brand/Ross), there was then a fiasco searching across all comedy for any offensive material in a ridiculous uproar. That sort of reaction would acheive nothing but holding the act of comedy back, in the same way that jumping on moral bandwagons when a game such as this is released will just prolong all video games being children’s fodder, or over the top meatfests.

    • avatar Dwain

      Hi, I found your blog post through a sercah for “Nertz”. It is cool to see others that know about the game. I hope you don’t mind but I wanted to let you know about playnertz.com, the site for the National Nertz Association. There is a bunch of interesting Nertz information there and you can also find out how to play Nertz online there. I hope you will check it out. Feel free to join and also let your friends and family know. Thanks

  18. As someone who is personally disgusted by rape, I see no difference between a game that gives you positive reinforcement for brutally executing terrified people at gunpoint (GTAIV), and Edmund/Rapelay.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ACSsUhFk7I

  19. avatar Keltic Rage

    Wow…..disturbing, to disturbing for m gaming practice. I can see how this can be considered a double standard but in the end it’s personal boundaries which is the issue. I for one will not be playing this game, but far be it for me to say that no one should play it. In the end this is a victory for freedom of speech. Good Luck!

  20. avatar Ryan

    I’d rather people play games like these to unleash their sick fantasies rather than take it to the real world and hurt real people.

    Yes, we need a lot more games like this.

    And for you nuts going on about “moral issue”… Here are a couple of comments from another forum:

    1. “Where do you draw the moral line?” Nowhere, you dolts. By censoring games we provide a base for the censors to censor other kinds of fiction.

    2. The moral line is drawn were real people get hurt. A virtual world has no real people.

  21. avatar ChrisW

    Paul Clark,

    “The game presents you with an option to rape, as does every day life.”

    Huh!?! I would love to stop this conversation RIGHT there, but then again you’re right to an extent; everyday life presents us with many options. Still… seriously? Everyday life presents us with the option to rape? In my world, NO! Whilst this may sound naive, everyday life does not present us the option to rape, murder, kill indiscriminately, or even kill oneself. Especially for a rather large and significant majority of the world population.

    *SIGH!* I don’t know how to qualify, yet quantify, this concept as a moral agent. Simply put, it goes against my moral identity. Thus, perhaps, this makes me inept to expand upon this topic.

    “Only sprites were harmed.”

    Once again. This is where the issue arises! Regardless of the depiction, the controlled simulation of ipso facto rape should, under any circumstance, be morally wrong! Why do you say? (we wouldn’t be having this conversation otherwise). Once again I revert to the topic concerning child pornography. Interpol and policing institutions of various governments state that “Child pornography is the consequence of the exploitation or sexual abuse perpetrated against a child. It can be defined as any means of DEPICTING or promoting sexual abuse of a child, including PRINT and/or audio, centered on sex acts [including provocative poses] or the genital organs of children.” (Wikipedia)

    Why have I brought this topic up again? Aside from it being a higher level of immoral behavior and the fact that you brought up Alan Moore’s Lost Girls, it is as controversial of a topic in “everyday life” as rape.

    By the way, have you actually read Lost Girls? I’m assuming you have. The depiction, although minute, is there! Hence other countries’ governments, like France, are undecided on publishing it due to their laws concerning child pornography. As for myself, I downloaded it and quickly scanned through it. And my conclusion? Yes, the depiction is there!!!

    Going back to rape; let me throw some reality bits at you about this:

    -It is estimated that a woman born in South Africa has a greater chance of being raped than learning how to read.

    -Victims of rape can be severely traumatized by the assault and may have difficulty functioning as well as they had been used to prior to the assault. Classified as Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome.

    -”Victim blaming” is holding the victim of a crime to be in whole or in part responsible for the crime. In extreme cases, victims are said to have “asked for it”, simply by not behaving demurely.

    Rape… the problem is that it is a sexual issue. And while this may sound absurd; very few people, if any, masturbate to a graphically violent video game, movie, or novel.

    Then again, it’s not absurd. It’s true!

    I stand my grounds. Simulated rape is critically more morally wrong than simulated killing or murder. No double standards about it. As I mentioned before, this is mainstream media we are talking about. While Edmund and Lost Girls are not considered mainstream media, they should not be exempt from this. A depiction within any type of media is still a depiction and thus is morally wrong.

  22. I think it’s fantastic we can have such varied opinions highlighted here. It really shows that Paul Greasley’s work has struck a chord within many gamers. Regardless of whether they enjoyed the experience or not.

    Enjoyed isn’t perhaps the right word. I didn’t take any pleasure from Edmund, it repulsed me. However it is a game, which I believe is a digital piece of art. To restrict artistic freedom is in itself morally abhorrent.

  23. @ChrisW
    Whilst I appreciate the rape facts, the depiction of rape in any form of generated media, be it art, or games, or books, does not (at least in anything I have encountered) make any assumption that rape is good, or is something that should exist in the real world. But these aren’t the real world. In writing, I can talk about genocide, I can talk about prostitution, I can talk about human trafficking, I can talk about abuse, and there are countless books which cover these topics in a truthful manner, and go on to be featured on Oprah or Richard and Judy’s book club. Yet time and time again, games are called up on every grievance, even something like Mass Effect was dragged through the bushes backwards for some panting, wheezing and a slight glimpse of side-boob.

    In terms of depicting a child, where no child has been present, and it is purely conceptual. If I drew a picture ( and it wouldn’t be good, I can’t draw more than stick men), and told you “Here is a picture of a 21 year old woman, naked, and I don’t think I have to explain to you what the grapefruit is doing.” It’d be somewhat creepy, due to the grapefruit, but the fact is this wouldn’t be classed as massively offensive, surely? The porn industry is large enough, and legal enough, that that couldn’t be the case. Now, same picture, I have changed nothing, I now tell you “Actually, that girl is 12″ You perception of the image is all that has changed, there is absolutely no difference in the two images, yet suddenly one is illegal, obscene and offensive (okay, first one was probably offensive, but that’s the grapefruit’s fault.)

    You’re refusal “in my world? NO!” just sounds childish. You have free will, you have the option of committing any number of inhumane, illegal and immoral activities. I am not saying “Everyone WILL”, merely “Everyone CAN.” It is our own moral limits that stop us, although, clearly not everyone.

    The point you raised is an interesting one though, you are saying a sexual issue is defiant of morality, due to the fact people may masturbate over it, yet, you wouldn’t to say Gears of War, or Texas Chainsaw Massacre? At least, that is the point I read from what you say. You are saying this is wrong because of my perspective of sexuality, yet, that is as limited a perspective as “it is wrong, because I say so.” There are probably people who masturbate over shopping channels, disney cartoons and Dr. Phil, does this mean these now need banning as to a very very very very minute amount of people they produce stimulation most would attribute to pornography?

  24. @Ryan
    Exactly!
    You have made me want to hug you.

  25. avatar Paul Greasley

    @ ChrisW
    “Everyday life presents us with the option to rape? In my world, NO! Whilst this may sound naive, everyday life does not present us the option to rape, murder, kill indiscriminately, or even kill oneself.”

    Then why do rapists, murderers and suicidals exist? Surely if there is no option to do these acts these breeds of people would be non-existent.

    But there is that option, just because you can’t fathom doing it doesn’t mean it can’t be done.

    You can live in your sugar coated fairy land if you want, I prefer reality.

  26. avatar ChrisW

    Paul Greasley,

    Oh my… “reality” versus “my sugar coated fairy land.” That was quite a dogged retort. Of course such people exist; refusing the existence of such is simply being ignorant.

    I’m going to go out on a rather large and long limb here. — In what you perceive as reality… No macro that! In what your community perceives as reality, are these things a common occurrence? Do the people you surround yourself with live in fear of being raped and murdered constantly? Is suicide so common amongst those around you that you would even go to the extent of putting it in your daily planner and throw a party with friends and family just for the occasion?

    I’m quite certain, despite your aforementioned quasi-personal experience, the answer for you is, “no.” However, for other people in other parts of the world the answer is sadly, “yes.” You see, unless you actually live such a reality, you shouldn’t go around saying that it is “your reality.” Because it isn’t. You are only fooling yourself and that is finite.

    But this is not really an argument I wish to continue, it’s just a response to your irrational comment. By the way, you do understand that the suicide analogy was to simply be absurd, right?

    Turning our attention back to jumping on the controversial bandwagon of controlling simulated rape as an art form in the realm of mainstream videogames; you do understand that it will never be widely accepted, right? If this is your, and likewise programmers’, ambition I, like many others who have the common sense to constantly deny their god-given rights to commit inhumane acts and know where to draw the moral line [a.k.a. moral agents], will continue to look down upon you and belittle you. Understand the ridicule and mockery that you will confront. That is a tangible and justifiable reality despite your belief that all of our actions are the product of antecedent causes and we have no real control over taking the opportunities life presents us.

    Lastly, I think it would be interesting for you to go out and ask those around you (your friends, relatives, co-workers, professors, people you respect, and people who respect you) what they think about this as an art form. Your moral community should represent, not reflect, the basis of your moral identity and that is where the moral line should be drawn.

  27. avatar ChrisW

    Paul Clark,

    Firstly, childish and naive are synonyms.

    Secondly, I’d like to ask you what you think about Registering Sex Offenders. Is it a double standard to force people to register themselves as sex offenders in the community they live in and not for those who have released because of murder or manslaughter?

    And lastly,
    “Offenders who served time for sexual assault were 7.5 times as likely as those convicted of other crimes to be rearrested for a new sexual assault.”
    (http://www.prevent-abuse-now.com/stats2.htm#Recidivism)

    “Sex offenders who returned for a new sex related offense did so within a few years of release. Of all the sex offenders who came back to an Ohio prison for a new sex offense, one half did so within two years, and two-thirds within three years.”
    (http://www.drc.ohio.gov/web/Reports/Ten_Year_Recidivism.pdf, page 3)

    Recidivism occurs because of the sexual excitement that comes from the domination and violation of the victim. In contrast, and in reference to someone masturbating over a graphically violent videogame, movie, or novel, an extremely small percentage of people kill the first time as a form of sexual arousal. Even many serial killers or recidivating killers state that they did not kill for sexual arousal, though some argue otherwise. I believe this is only a small chip off the tip of the iceberg in deflating the “it’s a double standard” argument we find when comparing these mature genres in videogames.

    In an attempt to keep this post shorter than the previous, I’ll finish with one question.

    Do you think playing a rape simulator will increase or decrease these recidivistic statistics?

  28. avatar ChrisW

    “Inside Shock Art”
    (http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0HMU/is_3_28/ai_73023799/)

    Be sure to thoroughly read “Shock Art in the Mainstream” on pages 2 and 3.

  29. avatar Paul Greasley

    @ chrisW

    Your missing the point completely, you can say rape doesn’t exist all you want but the option is always there.

    “Turning our attention back to jumping on the controversial bandwagon of controlling simulated rape as an art form in the realm of mainstream videogames; you do understand that it will never be widely accepted, right?”

    If I wanted to make something commercially acceptable, id be making something else, the fact you even needed to state that it has no commercial value (outside of japan) to someone who has been doing this for years shows how little you know.

    “Lastly, I think it would be interesting for you to go out and ask those around you (your friends, relatives, co-workers, professors, people you respect, and people who respect you) what they think about this as an art form.”

    I did when I released it, some people took something from it, some people didn’t, and the rest didn’t play it but still held it upon themselves to “flame-on” for pages about the apparent moral outrage, they were then told to politely “fuck off if you don’t like it”.

  30. avatar Paul Greasley

    FYI most of my close family haven’t played it yet, it was mostly close friends and co-workers.

    • avatar Denise

      I really REALLY wanna c it again but i just wish they woulf roeepn the show in San Francisco!! New York lets it run 4ever but u cant find a show anywhere in California! Cnt wait 2 b able 2 do it with my high school or college or whenever it comes available 2 rent on MTI or sumtin I dnt care wat it takes! I will b in Wicked!! Mwahahaha!!!

  31. avatar TheyLive

    To Chris W
    Are you as outspoken about tea bagging in FPS games? Because if you are not you should be, just as much if not more so.

  32. avatar sven

    Oh yea while we are banning rape in games, let’s ban nudity and rape on paintings. What? It’s also a medium and games are art as much as they are entertainment. In fact lets ban any content from history that mentions rape. I am really sad that violence is such a normal thing that people cheer for it yet sex is disgusting. When combining the two you again get a even bigger issue.
    The game was not meant to be main-stream or given as a learning tool too kids. If an adult cannot control himself over a indie pixeld game then we can all just burn down the whole industry since it poses a threat.

    This is anyway an endless discussion that will go no where because of standards put upon by the western culture. Good day!

  33. avatar RSS

    Sven your a retartd! ban nudity and rape on paintings? Look at Chirsw opinion though he’s longwindd.

  34. avatar anon

    Wow, that ChrisW guy sounds like a wanker.

  35. avatar Mark Boson

    You know what? I read the entire arguement and got a bit worried about the game… then i watched the youtube clip and it re-inforced the fact that the game would feature an unpleasant rape scene… but then i played the game. All the way through, to an ending. And I actually thing it was brilliant.

    There’s a story here, in this game, and that story offers the player an experience. Like any experience (book, movie, painting) it’s got it’s up’s and downs, it’s got it’s shocks, and it’s rewards. I mean, I watched platoon for the first time ever tonight and that was a shocking film.. What happened in Cambodia was really f******g tragic, and the film made me feel that.

    The story about ‘Eddie’ and ‘Micheal’ is a good one. And the rape that takes place in the game is integral to the plot and the experience. If we were to ban this kind of expression, these kinds of experiences wouldn’t be built and we’d miss out I think.

    • avatar Mbadla

      Back when I started pniaylg you only got one name level at 9th (I think). Superheroes make sense now, though I think Batman would make an excellent random encounter.

  36. avatar thankza

    I was going to flame this piece of shit back to the abyss when I saw “rapist”, but I gave it a play before, I have to say it wasn’t too bad, alot better than the banter makes out, great game even.

  37. avatar Meg

    Are those “few girls” he knows aware about this game? If some guy used me as an excuse to do something like this, I would be horrified, especially if I had thought he was my friend. (Plus, “I’m dating a rape victim!” sounds a helluva lot like “I have friends who are black!”) Anyone who has more than a handful of female friends probably knows at least one rape victim, whether or not they know that. Simply knowing people who have been raped, or even having heard their stories, does NOT make someone qualified to decide what kind of commentary on rape is and isn’t exploitative.

    Let’s be frank about this for a minute. This game is about a crime that’s usually (and in-game, specifically) committed by men against women, and it was made by a man, using a medium that appeals primarily to men, and it is now being defended by hordes of men. Kudos to those of you who are refusing to buy into it, but still… there are some pretty crucial voices that are missing here.

  38. avatar Rage [RAOS]

    I think you all suck, and the more time that we waste playing pieces of shit like this, the less time we all collectively have to grind in the name of the Alliance/Horde.

  39. avatar ComaRage

    Shock game made to shock gets shocked opinions on shocking.

  40. avatar elle

    CHRISW, MARRY ME!

    • avatar Marisol

      Kuti, I’m going to have to firmly and refstcepully disagree with you. Everyone should always ask one another if they want to have sex. Just because a woman is in a relationship with a man does not mean she gets to ASSUME that he wants to have sex. That’s the exact type of thinking this campaign is trying to challenge and eradicate. Also, I think I see where you were trying to go with your later statements and I’d have to say that I’m thoroughly offended. How exactly did you think it was appropriate to blatantly slut-shame on a sex positive, safe space website!?

  41. avatar OT

    I hope everyone who has complained about this game was equally appalled by GTA, otherwise you need to recalibrate your moral compasses. You’d rather be murdered than raped? Very well. Personally, I’d rather have neither happen to me, thanks, but I think it is really silly to try and act like the two are completely different levels of inhumanity.

    @ChrisW: Don’t be silly. Yes, rape is illegal in war, but so is murder. You can’t just kill whoever you want, you have to shoot at other combatants, etc.

  42. avatar Ty

    Paul, I feel embarrassed for you, seeing someone make something solely for shock sake. Deny it all you will.

    But hey, now people have heard about your little game. That’s what it’s about.

  43. avatar Joe

    I think this is exactly what Paul was trying to do. I’ve played Edmund, and as an art form, it is brilliant. I was horrified, revolted, and sickened at what act’s “I” had made the character do. As I continued to play, I delved deeper into to just what was going through my mind, as well as what could’ve possibly been going through Edmund’s mind.

    @ChrisW
    This world is a sick place. As a son of a Homicide/Serious Crimes detective, I know just how fucked people can be, and just how taxing the results of being exposed to these things can be. Rape is a serious issue. Part of the human condition is the right to choose. If you found this game so offensive, why play it? It’s obvious that it has “offended” you felt it necessary to come and voice just how “vile” and “morally repulsive” Paul’s work was.

    @Paul Greasely
    Your work was brilliant! I was thinking for hours after, trying to understand certain things, and gather my feelings and emotions together, so that I could further understand just what was happening on my screen. Bravo sir. Bravo

  44. avatar This game sucks

    go fuck yourself.

  45. avatar Marisol

    I would just like to respectfully say that I have never come out about weethhr or not I am a rape survivor or have been the victim of molestation (I think?). I think I probably have come out about being the grandchild of Holocaust survivors, but regardless, I’d appreciate it if people could refrain from making assumptions about my past. I’m not trying to make an authoritative judgment or be the ultimate arbiter of rape jokes. No one can fill that role. However, as someone who enjoys offensive humor (even about the Holocaust) I was trying to use this flowchart to help myself organize my own feelings on the subject. I tried to think about why some jokes offend me and others do not, and this is the map of my thinking. I do not expect everyone to agree with it and if you don’t, I’d love to hear alternative ideas or criteria for what makes a joke offensive or not to you.

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